In today’s episode, Orsolya Herbein is here to talk all about how to properly build a brand. She shares the importance of building a brand that speaks to the desires and values of your customer. We discuss where some businesses need help with their brand strategy and how they may be spinning wheels before having the foundation of their strategy laid down.


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Transcript For This Episode:

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Stacy Jones: Welcome to marketing mistakes and how to avoid them i’m Stacey Jones and i’m so happy to be here with you all today and I want to give a very warm welcome to orci her body. or she is the partner and creative director of brand three an agency that helps to transform brands and build plans to enable businesses to engage and retain the right customers by lighting brand.

Marketing and customer experience as a former owner of an agency specializing in graphic design and website development or she has a unique perspective as a visual problem solver and clients report an average growth of 61% and annual revenue within two years of implementing their agencies process.

Today, or she and I are going to be chatting about the secrets to making marketing work by providing clear messaging and imagery. Will learn what works more she’s perspective, what should be avoided and how some businesses just missed the mark or she welcome so happy to have you here today.

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Orsolya Herbein: Thank you so much for having me.

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Stacy Jones: Well, I love starting off our conversations by having our listeners learn a little bit more about what got you here today how did you come to found this agency and focus on brand and imagery and marketing.

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Orsolya Herbein: OK, so the story goes that.

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Orsolya Herbein: By trade i’m a graphic designer graduated from school work for a small agency and then ended up being an in house designer at a company for a long, long time and that became a little boring, so I started freelancing. And when I started freelancing I met matt Chris was my current business partner, and I will says go to designer. For a long time he’s been kind of a brand strategies, I think, since 2004 I met him in 2010 and from 10 to 16 I was his go to designer and, as I was working with matt I started to realize.

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Orsolya Herbein: That i’ve been kind of building brands myself, because my design was always very functional and I always was looking for something.

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Orsolya Herbein: To box myself enemy which is interesting, you know as a as an artist and the creative person.

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Orsolya Herbein: Literally sky’s the limit and I know for myself that if I don’t have any boxes or boundaries around me then i’ll just fit over that forever and nothing will ever get done.

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Orsolya Herbein: And to me design is so interesting because you know you have to make it work you are communicating right, but then you add branding to it, and now.

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Orsolya Herbein: Design has to kind of align with a strategic approach, and now you have a box and you, you know you have to you have to have all these things happen, you know it has to be functional has to be recasting you to an audience but.

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Orsolya Herbein: You also have to make it beautiful and to me that’s, a challenge that I really enjoy and strive in to a point that I went to.

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Orsolya Herbein: dinner oh there’s an art garage and they have just some random art classes and and.

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Orsolya Herbein: i’m unable to do just art anymore, like the i’m totally ruined as an artist, because I would go down there, and people are like let’s mess around with ink and.

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Orsolya Herbein: just see the medium and what it can do and i’m like I think this can be a mother’s day gift for my mom like everything has a purpose or function i’m like can just do art for the fun of it anymore.

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Orsolya Herbein: Because i’m looking for those boundaries and everything like okay I can’t just waste my time fiddling around with ink if it doesn’t have some sort of an outcome.

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Orsolya Herbein: Over like I can use this as a birthday gift or a mother’s day gift or something you know so it’s it’s it’s really funny but that’s kind of how it started and and.

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Orsolya Herbein: matt asked me in 2015 if I wanted to become his exit plan, essentially, and we put our businesses together by then, I had a pretty healthy freelance business and that’s how we started and.

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Stacy Jones: that’s awesome.

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Stacy Jones: And when you’re working with clients now, what do you do to get the ball rolling, how do you figure out where to focus that art is an expression versus, you know as just a thing for the brand itself, how do you corral them in and get the process going.

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Orsolya Herbein: Well, the number one strategy and everybody should and could be able to even utilize this, you know as as a very useful advice I thing.

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Orsolya Herbein: Is that your brand isn’t built for you Okay, if your brand has a functionality, that it needs to engage an audience then your brand is built for your audience, so the number one strategy that.

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Orsolya Herbein: We base everything on is to build brands for our customers ideal customer right, so we figure out, you know let’s say there’s a plumbing business.

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Orsolya Herbein: You know they have all these customers and we usually ask them tell us about your best customer or it’s beth okay it’s bad so let’s learn about beth Why is beth grade.

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Orsolya Herbein: And, and we really dive into the ideal customer and figure out how we can bring in more I usually stayed the question I asked a question.

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Orsolya Herbein: From my clients, can you imagine if you had 100 beth’s walking in the door, tomorrow, where would your business be and they just wow.

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Orsolya Herbein: That would be amazing and i’m like that’s what we’re doing that’s what we’re doing and we’re going to build a brand that engages all the beth is to come in and work with you and that’s really the number one strategy, you know, to build brands that.

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Orsolya Herbein: Speak to the needs and desires and the value value what that ideal customer values.

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Orsolya Herbein: Very quickly, because they’re not going to give you time, so we need to have that very clearly stated with the message and the image to make that immediate connection, so they don’t have to think because they want.

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Stacy Jones: And this applies to not just any type of brand but also services and then even into B2B it doesn’t have to be a B2C landscape that you’re talking about.

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Orsolya Herbein: Absolutely absolutely everybody every business, who has a customer has a best customer and there’s a reason for that and those customers can be replicated internally we can intentionally go after those best customers and build a business for them.

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Stacy Jones: what’s The next step that you do so you’ve identified that here is amy your perfect person that you want to build around and replicate you want to marching army of amy’s What do you do after that identification.

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Orsolya Herbein: So the next question is really what does amy want right and in terms of your services right, so if you’re a plumber, or if you are a landscaper or, if you are a B2B let’s say, do you do commercial construction and amy’s a property manager or something like that.

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Orsolya Herbein: You know, the question is, what does amy want and there’s different answers in in in every business right.

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Orsolya Herbein: Sometimes you could be the same business, but your ideal customer might value different things just because you have some strength in certain things right, so you have to align the strength.

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Orsolya Herbein: The vision, the goal and what the customer runs into one unified language that will resonate with amy right so really, really clearly stating what.

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Orsolya Herbein: Things are and what the value is so, for example, if amy is a person who really values time saving and you provide that on some level or they really value, a partnership, where a relationship and any know.

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Orsolya Herbein: you’re no longer just.

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Orsolya Herbein: You know competing on transactional elements but you’re you know you you’re providing a partnership, a trusted relationship that needs to be built.

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Orsolya Herbein: So you know that’s that’s something that can be woven into that high level messaging so amy can immediately connect with the with the business and say oh wait where has this been all my life now i’m reading on and everything else so matter afterwards.

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Stacy Jones: And my assumption is as you’re doing this you’re looking at replicating this across all your points of marketing so whether it’s your website, whether it’s your brochures, whether it’s your storefront However, you are creating this, you are making sure it’s one continuous message.

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Orsolya Herbein: Absolutely and and there’s a very specific reason for that and that is.

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Orsolya Herbein: We.

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Orsolya Herbein: brands, need to be memorable they need to be something that you can retain as a market need the market can retaining right, so there are.

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Orsolya Herbein: Businesses in a few of them that have loads of money loads of cash and they can saturate the market by coming out of the tap you know, like.

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Orsolya Herbein: Everywhere you turn Everywhere you go you see a truck ovi You see, in your mailbox You see, on your local commercials or whatever, I mean they’re everywhere.

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Orsolya Herbein: And that’s how you retain it because they’re all over the place you’ve seen them all around so that’s called frequency.

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Orsolya Herbein: But if you don’t have a large amount of budget to saturate the market with being everywhere, because that cost a lot of money, the next best thing you can do is to make all your materials consistent.

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Orsolya Herbein: You know, because if I see a truck and i’m intrigued and i’m intrigued enough to retain the the URL or the name of the business and I looked him up.

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Orsolya Herbein: i’ve seen a truck now I look them up on our website, I see the website me look the same they feel the same they say the same.

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Orsolya Herbein: Now i’ve seen it twice and i’ll check them out of social media, then I need to Google reviews and everything is in alignment now i’ve seen them, three, four or five times in a row and i’m starting to okay.

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Orsolya Herbein: it’s resonating XIV business is all about this and it’s consistent across the board, not only that that consistency allows me to trust the brand.

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Orsolya Herbein: So even if you’re a brand with a loads of cash that you can saturate the market for me when I come in and validate you know I want that consistent experience across all your materials, because trust is the number one way to to you know that leads to engagement, so when you are consistent.

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Orsolya Herbein: With messaging and imaging everywhere it’s easier for me trust, because we learn from national brands national brands are very, very strategic about that and that’s actually a very small thing that small business can apply, you know to to them, just to appear consistent across the board.

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Stacy Jones: Is there anything else, that they should be doing with this so now you have made sure that your messaging is consistent, you have made sure that it is anywhere and everywhere in the same manner, what is the next step from there.

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Orsolya Herbein: Well, you could have the best brand right, and you can have the best marketing strategy and marketing tactics to put your brand out there.

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Orsolya Herbein: and your best brand is engaging the audience to get these loads of ideal customers in, and you can flop it on customer experience like this right so that’s why at brand three we always look at marketing, which is what our customer wants.

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Orsolya Herbein: In terms of brand marketing and customer experience, all together, because.

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Orsolya Herbein: Any one of which is ignored, you can fail right.

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Orsolya Herbein: So you know there’s a lot of times, one of our best customers for us as a business, who doesn’t have a great brand because they just didn’t think about strategically align our brand.

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Orsolya Herbein: But they have created customer reviews right so that’s an easy fix because what happened, what happens is they have the audience reviews, but the perception of what you see.

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Orsolya Herbein: Is in professional it doesn’t engage the audience it’s not trusted so they don’t look the way they.

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Orsolya Herbein: You know they don’t their brands don’t reflect the greatness of their.

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Orsolya Herbein: quality of their products and services right so that’s that’s a super easy fix in our role, then we love doing it it’s much harder when you have a.

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Orsolya Herbein: Recent look and you’ve been kind of marketing and getting customers, but you have one and two star reviews that’s a lot harder for me to fix because that kind of.

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Orsolya Herbein: indicates some internal issues you have a lot of turnover, you know something wrong with your culture internally.

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Orsolya Herbein: You know you have to remember brand is resonating internally and externally externally towards marketing and engaging or prospects and customers and then internally it’s to retain.

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Orsolya Herbein: Your employees recruit the right and ideal employees and to deliver an experience that your customers are expecting based on the brand promise that you have right so that’s the third step is to ensure that you.

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Orsolya Herbein: By all means, try to exceed expectations and the very least.

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Orsolya Herbein: deliver the promise that you’re making so if your promise is a trusted relationship then work hard to be that trusted partner for your customers if yours.

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Orsolya Herbein: is exceptional outdoor living then you’re going to work hard and provide exceptional outdoor living experiences for your customers when every step of the way as they’re walking around.

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Orsolya Herbein: You know the journey be being your customers and some some businesses that’s a shorter transaction some businesses retaining customers for years to come.

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Orsolya Herbein: And you know that’s a longer customer journey, where you have to kind of weigh each touch point against that promise and making sure that your employees are empowered to deliver that experience.

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Stacy Jones: Are there any mistakes along the way that you see that are very common that people make.

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Orsolya Herbein: there’s a lot of mistakes number one mistake, I think, in a small business marketing world is to just skip the strategy skip branding and just go straight to tactics.

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Orsolya Herbein: If you ask us an average small business owners like wow So what do you think marketing is they’re going to tell you I see your website it’s direct mail it’s all that.

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Orsolya Herbein: And you know you walk into a small business world what’s happening, they have the seo guy who never communicated to the web guy who never communicated to the social media intern who they hired and you know.

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Orsolya Herbein: Whenever communicates to the business owners and i’m just saying it’s all over the place, you know the silo tactics that are are disjointed and not working in sync.

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Orsolya Herbein: are causing a tremendous amount of marketing waste, and you know when i’m telling you.

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Orsolya Herbein: You know your your marketing budget can you know you can literally be wasting 80% of that budget by throwing in a tactics without really having that strong foundation of a brand that.

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Orsolya Herbein: has the power to engage an audience, because you know you just throw yourself at the way you are without making it alignment.

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Orsolya Herbein: People walk by it and they don’t get it and they don’t understand and it’s not for them you’re not speaking their language I don’t care that your family on.

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Orsolya Herbein: You know, because at the first point of engagement, all I care about is what’s in it for me and then I can care that your family on if I have three businesses coming at me what I need what I want.

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Orsolya Herbein: And why don’t let me spend me Leon i’ll might choose that one but that’s not very starts, whatever it starts is what’s in it, for me, because that I can connect to very quickly.

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Orsolya Herbein: You know, without me thinking and then I can investigate and learn more about you and make a decision to do business with you but throwing yourself out with that strategy, it can, can you know, result in a lot of wasted.

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Orsolya Herbein: money.

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Orsolya Herbein: And that’s all kind of what we are here to stop.

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Stacy Jones: And it’s more than just the wasted money on your marketing tactics it’s also the wasted money if your marketing team.

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Stacy Jones: And the individuals who are spending hours, who are pushing and promoting and going through all of these steps, because you have true human hours that go into backing, all of this, so if you have someone who is not aiming at the right goal, then you’re just any wheels there to.

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Orsolya Herbein: Exactly no that’s that’s exactly right it’s it’s a tremendous amount of waste, essentially, so you know as far as mistakes, you know.

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Orsolya Herbein: That those siloed individualized you know tactics and I know the business owners are feeling the pain of it’s not working it’s not creating traction, and the reason why is because you haven’t thought about intentionally building a brand that engages an audience that you’re after.

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Stacy Jones: What are more mistakes that people make.

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Orsolya Herbein: Well it’s probably on the experience side you know they’ll do all the right things, and then they just don’t deliver the right experience you know, building a culture isn’t for the faint of heart, you know and every business owner knows that.

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Orsolya Herbein: But.

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Orsolya Herbein: And also, you know, not knowing what exactly we are promising to deliver, you know because.

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Orsolya Herbein: it’s one thing that maybe the business owner has in their mind, but it hasn’t been materialized in some sort of way that the team can kind of align with that right.

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Orsolya Herbein: And they’re all just kind of doing their J O B and there really is in.

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Orsolya Herbein: buying into the goals and visions of the business because they don’t know they are not aware they’re unable to deliver that experience and then.

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Orsolya Herbein: we’re getting those bad reviews and you know that’s today’s day and age is detrimental, you know just you know one customer can destroy a business.

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Orsolya Herbein: like this, you know and not knowing how to respond to that or responding to it in the wrong way is yeah those are those are hard hard stuff so you know delivering.

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Orsolya Herbein: The experiences is something that’s.

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Orsolya Herbein: Very much can be intentional and deliberate and and you know something that’s designed and not just left the chances like oh hoping this new employee will do the tricks.

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Orsolya Herbein: Not without training and not without them really buying into the mission and goals and vision of the company and understanding what their job is by delivering that promise.

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Stacy Jones: And so now you just switched it where it’s not just targeting amy where you’re trying to build this whole package of branding and.

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Stacy Jones: storytelling you’re actually bringing this also and saying we have to do this inside of businesses too.

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Stacy Jones: Because if your employees are on the same page, not only are they not communicating to the amy’s of the world, but they’re miss communicating internally to and you’re opening yourself up to your bad reviews coming from that side as well.

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Orsolya Herbein: Absolutely, and I know that your your listeners can relate to this, and I am very much relating to this.

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Orsolya Herbein: there’s nothing worse than hiring someone pouring into that person and then watching them goal.

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Orsolya Herbein: it’s you know talking about race right that is so painful losing employees, you know, bringing on new employees that is really hard.

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Orsolya Herbein: And and and that’s why that is also part of the plan, because you need a team that will be able to take your vision.

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Orsolya Herbein: and make it into reality right and that’s what the team is for, but you have to understand how it all aligns right.

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Orsolya Herbein: Your brand is a perception it, you know it’s a perception in mind of an audience if i’m looking at something i’m judging it i’m formulating thoughts and feelings about it i’m.

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Orsolya Herbein: You know wondering if it’s for me that’s brand right when you’re marketing you’re putting your brand out there.

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Orsolya Herbein: You know so you’re very intentionally going in front of certain audiences and hopefully your ideal audience read a brand that connects them and because they are seeing they are reading your promise.

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Orsolya Herbein: You know, oh, we are trusted partners or we are you know.

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Orsolya Herbein: We have exceptional customer experience or whatever it is that the brand promises in those marketing materials, who.

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Orsolya Herbein: Is the promise.

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Orsolya Herbein: But then they walk in the door.

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Orsolya Herbein: And now you responsible to make sure that what they engaged read I want that exceptional customer experience, because my current experience did not have it, you guys are saying you have it i’m coming in.

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Orsolya Herbein: You have to deliver that promise that experience on the customer level has to align with the promise right.

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Orsolya Herbein: But you can only do that with a team that knows what they’re doing and what they are supposed to deliver right so that’s kind of how it comes in a full circle, so you know when you think marketing, I have a.

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Orsolya Herbein: You know, on my.

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Orsolya Herbein: website or number one headline is rethink marketing, you know transform from noise to clarity and engage the right customer.

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Orsolya Herbein: You gotta rethink marketing because marketing is in those tactics marketing is a plan.

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Orsolya Herbein: That has all these elements and as it comes into full circle and anybody who is selling your marketing in the silos aren’t looking at your business your vision your goals.

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Orsolya Herbein: You know your team in a holistic level where they can really start making a difference and creating traction with all the marketing money that you’re spending on advertising yourself.

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Stacy Jones: You know or on sending on employees who were you’re doing that, instead of spending on the marketing money that you could be doing if you had it dialed in.

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Orsolya Herbein: yeah and you know just think about it.

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Orsolya Herbein: In terms of an advice, the better that customer experience the lawyer your marketing budget can be, because if you’re delivering an exceptional customer experience you to be exceeding their expectations.

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Orsolya Herbein: Anybody who needs your service they’ll be vouching for you, I mean you know that’s the beauty of delivering a high level experience is that your customer base will be doing the recruiting and referring for you, without you even having to ask.

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Stacy Jones: And so, how can I love this nurse learn more about you find you and say Okay, I want to dive in I want to figure out how to get my own a nice Where do they reach out to you.

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Orsolya Herbein: So the website is brand three.net there’s a schedule a call button that actually links directly to my calendar, so you can schedule a call with me anytime i’m also you can find me on linkedin.

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Orsolya Herbein: My full name or she Irvine and you can connect me with me on linkedin and i’m happy to chat with anyone who is.

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Orsolya Herbein: You know just looking for a little bit more information, or at least some.

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Orsolya Herbein: Some way to to kind of gauge what they have been doing and what they can be doing better.

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Stacy Jones: And or she what are some other last parting words of advice that you would give to our listeners today.

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Orsolya Herbein: um.

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Orsolya Herbein: um.

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Orsolya Herbein: Maybe me personally for me this this this is is one advice that I, I could think would be beneficial.

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Orsolya Herbein: Is that I know that there’s all kinds of different personality traits you know, some people are stronger here meeker there and blah blah blah, we all have our strengths.

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Orsolya Herbein: One of my greatest strength, I believe, is empathy you know, being able to step into other people’s shoes and that’s What helps me build these brands.

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Orsolya Herbein: Because whenever a client comes and talks to me I empathize with them, but I also step into the shoes of their audience and see from the outside, in right and.

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Orsolya Herbein: While I believe empathy is something that i’ve been blessed with, I also believe that it can be practiced you know I encourage my.

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Orsolya Herbein: My clients and also your listeners to to to really try to have the point of view.

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Orsolya Herbein: of others, you know my business partner, has a great analogy for for this just imagine that your business is a boss and you’re the bus driver you’re driving the bus he had the point of view of a bus driver, he said what’s ahead of you.

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Orsolya Herbein: You have passengers which are your clients on the boss, but you don’t really know what the bus ride feels like you know well, you don’t know what the bus looks like from the outside, when you’re driving.

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Orsolya Herbein: So sometimes it’s good to stop the bus get off and look at it and talk to all your passengers and kind of just ask and investigate.

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Orsolya Herbein: On what the experience looks like and and really not in a guided way we’re doing this right know how does it feel.

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Orsolya Herbein: How, you know tell us why you know we are good at this or not good at this What could we improve things like that just having that that.

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Orsolya Herbein: That feedback and and you being able to to to get off the bus and look at your business from the outside Okay, what if I was my client.

Orsolya Herbein: You know, and just kind of put all your biases and technical lingo aside and really be a customer.

Orsolya Herbein: And then it will help you see what messaging would resonate better you know, sometimes business owners have a very technical service, for example, and they muddied the water with very technical lingo that doesn’t mean anything to the market, you know the market just wants it.

Orsolya Herbein: And they are business owners themselves, they don’t know anything about gigabytes or frequencies or whatever, have you like you know.

Orsolya Herbein: Space or email or any of that that kind of language and all you need to say to them is that, let us take the it burden off your shoulder.

Orsolya Herbein: and gain a trusted partner to to to take that so you can focus on what you’re doing best money your business, you know, and you don’t have to worry about all that.

Orsolya Herbein: Technology stuff so that language will resonate much better than all we have 900 servers and 750 terabytes you know.

Stacy Jones: It doesn’t mean anything.

Stacy Jones: Listen it sounded great to the person saying it.

Stacy Jones: But the customers like How does that actually benefit me I don’t even get that world, this is your world to be.

Orsolya Herbein: Exactly exactly so you know I my My advice would be is, if you can practice empathy and stepping in a shooter shoes of others, especially when it comes to your business and employees.

Orsolya Herbein: And what does it feel like to work for you, what does it feel like to be one of your customers, what do they see when they look from the outside, in.

Orsolya Herbein: And, and even your employees, what do they see when they look from the inside, in you know, then, and what did they see and and and and I think it will help you make better choices and.

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Orsolya Herbein: make adjustments to your business internally and externally, to be more.

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Orsolya Herbein: fluid and more in line with what it is that you actually want your customers and employees to experience you know.

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Stacy Jones: where she Thank you so much for joining us today.

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Stacy Jones: I will say that there are things you said that i’m going to take back to our team to look at about our own agency, so I have absolutely no doubt that our listeners also found some very valuable nuggets of advice in there, so really appreciate your time and you’re sharing.

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Orsolya Herbein: Absolutely, it was my pleasure, and thank you so much for having me.

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Stacy Jones: Of course, and then to our listeners, thank you for tuning in to another episode of marketing mistakes and how to avoid them. I look forward to speaking with you this next week and, until then, if you want to figure out how to better leverage other people’s content. And get your brand seen in it reach out to our agency, we can talk about all things product placement influencer marketing and ways to get your brand to shine I look forward to chatting with you at another time have a great.

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Marketing Mistakes and How To Avoid Them Reviews 

Must-Listen For Every Brand Marketer (And Owner)

This should be required listening for everyone who owns a business, works in marketing, or is interested in the business of entertainment. Great stuff!

The Best Marketing Podcast Ever!

Stacy is a brilliant branding strategist and she really knows how to bring out the best in her guests! This show is fun AND educational! If you’re looking to understand the world of marketing, branding, digital marketing, influencer marketing and more, look no further. This show has awesome insight into some of the greatest marketing minds out there today, and they provide practical advice you can use in your business today. #FanForLife

Awesome podcast for all marketers!

Keep them coming

Practical and pointed advice.

Stacy does a really great job making this a highly actionable podcast for business owners. With a focus on marketing, she covers a wide range of related topics as well and is always very specific with her questions so that the listener gets pointed advice instead of vague concepts to take away. It’s also really helpful to the hear the why behind any marketing tactic so that we can decide if something sounds like a good fit for where we are at in this moment.

Love this marketing podcast!

Lori has a way of finding new insights to share every week. I loved being a guest, but I enjoy hearing her many fascinating conversations with other marketers even more. Great show!

I love Stacey Jones!

I absolutely loved being on this podcast! Stacey is amazing – real, down to earth, and genuinely curious and interested in learning – this makes for a very engaging conversation and valuable podcast!

Thank you for your podcast! I LOVE IT

I just listened to the episode named Insights To Product Placement Brand Marketers Need To Know, and I really enjoyed every minute of it! There are so many ways to approach product placement in a manner that provides wins for many – and it is not always driven by money. I am looking forward to listening to more!

Stuff we need to know!!

Anyone who is in business should be listening to this podcast! Incredible insights and advice.

Such a wealth of knowledge! 🧠

This is one of the most insightful podcasts that I have ever come across! Stacy does such a great job of sharing her wisdom and I love how she leads meaningful conversations with guests who bring so much experience to the table. Highly recommend checking this show out – you won’t be disappointed!

Awesome Podcast!!!

Stacy, host of the Marketing Mistakes (And How To Avoid Them) Podcast, highlights all marketing and more in this can’t miss podcast! The host and expert guests offer insightful advice and information that is helpful to anyone that listens!
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